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Fagan dumps on Free Agency

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Fagan dumps on Free Agency

Postby Mr Q on Fri Aug 03, 2018 11:44 am

http://www.afl.com.au/news/2018-08-03/i ... his-doubts

You can't argue with him really - the only winners from Free Agency have been the big Melbourne clubs and Geelong. It hasn't helped in WA/SA or the fringe Melbourne clubs, and makes it near on impossible in Queensland to retain players. GWS are coming to the point it will screw them as well.

The obvious sign of this is that GC's Lynch is looking to move to one of Collingwood, Hawthorn or Richmond.

It most definitely needs a revamp, and the clear starting point would be that the club picking up the Free Agent has to pay something for them at the draft. The only time it works is the delisted free agents, where it gives a player a chance to train at a potential new club and just go on the list if it works out. These of course aren't players in massive demand.

Free agency only works if *all* clubs have the same effective access to it, but it's become brutally clear that they don't. There's no point in equalisation policies if you then set up a process by which a couple of clubs become effective feeder teams for the big clubs in Melbourne.

The AFLPA would kick up a stink if it was killed off, but maybe someone needs to tell them that it would be even worse for them if a couple of clubs folded and there were 90 odd less AFL places each year.
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Re: Fagan dumps on Free Agency

Postby Fat Side on Fri Aug 03, 2018 12:02 pm

Mr Q wrote:http://www.afl.com.au/news/2018-08-03/is-free-agency-working-fagan-has-his-doubts

You can't argue with him really - the only winners from Free Agency have been the big Melbourne clubs and Geelong. It hasn't helped in WA/SA or the fringe Melbourne clubs, and makes it near on impossible in Queensland to retain players. GWS are coming to the point it will screw them as well.

The obvious sign of this is that GC's Lynch is looking to move to one of Collingwood, Hawthorn or Richmond.

It most definitely needs a revamp, and the clear starting point would be that the club picking up the Free Agent has to pay something for them at the draft. The only time it works is the delisted free agents, where it gives a player a chance to train at a potential new club and just go on the list if it works out. These of course aren't players in massive demand.

Free agency only works if *all* clubs have the same effective access to it, but it's become brutally clear that they don't. There's no point in equalisation policies if you then set up a process by which a couple of clubs become effective feeder teams for the big clubs in Melbourne.

The AFLPA would kick up a stink if it was killed off, but maybe someone needs to tell them that it would be even worse for them if a couple of clubs folded and there were 90 odd less AFL places each year.


The payment method should be identical to the father/son and academy selections where they're attributed values. It would need some tweaking as, unlike the FS/Academy the other club that selects the player must take that player if the intended club chooses not to draft the player. FA should still revolve around the player being able to go to a club of their choice. If a value should be determined when the club and player decide to use FA.
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Re: Fagan dumps on Free Agency

Postby WCE Booka 89 on Fri Aug 03, 2018 10:38 pm

There is a lot of things that really make Free Agency such a pain for the AFL. They have tried to cover themself by only allowing it after 7 years, which means players can generally leave right as they hit their peak. So a team spends 7 years developing these guys then they can just have that investment ripped away and another team enjoys the spoils. Another thing that contributes to make the 7 year issue worse is how long it takes a lot of players to develop. Its not like NFL or NBA where players are playing top levels in year 2 and 3. You really don't see a lot of players hitting their straps until year 4. Sometimes you get lucky and have players burst thru the gates, but they are extremely outnumbered. That issue hurts free agency for 2 reasons, firstly the 7 years you spend developing you get very little out of and secondly, you are now having to replace them with a draft pick, which in most cases won't equal what you paid for them so you are back at square one.

Ideally lifting the draft age to 20 would be nice and would mean you could get more out of draft picks before losing them.

AFL is also stuck inbetween semi-professional sports and proper professional sports. You rarely hear of players in other sports leaving to go home. They leave for money or they leave for winning opportunities, not so that they can go back to where they grew up and live down the road from mum and dad (ok maybe there may be some cases of this, but the level of this happening at AFL is just ridiculous in comparison)
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Re: Fagan dumps on Free Agency

Postby sydney eagle on Tue Aug 07, 2018 1:01 pm

Could a way be found to increase the compensation to the club losing the player to free agency ? What will Gold Coast be likely to get for Lynch under the current system ? A late first round pick ?or a second rounder ? Hardly seems fair. Maybe they could hold an auction and the teams make their bids to the club that he is coming from. A player like Lynch should be worth at least a first rounder and probably more.
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Re: Fagan dumps on Free Agency

Postby Fat Side on Tue Aug 07, 2018 1:19 pm

sydney eagle wrote:Could a way be found to increase the compensation to the club losing the player to free agency ? What will Gold Coast be likely to get for Lynch under the current system ? A late first round pick ?or a second rounder ? Hardly seems fair. Maybe they could hold an auction and the teams make their bids to the club that he is coming from. A player like Lynch should be worth at least a first rounder and probably more.


The AFL are desperate for the Suns to succeed. Don't be surprised to see them get two first round picks (the first one after their first pick - at the moment pick 2)
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Re: Fagan dumps on Free Agency

Postby Mr Q on Tue Aug 07, 2018 3:37 pm

sydney eagle wrote:Could a way be found to increase the compensation to the club losing the player to free agency ? What will Gold Coast be likely to get for Lynch under the current system ? A late first round pick ?or a second rounder ? Hardly seems fair. Maybe they could hold an auction and the teams make their bids to the club that he is coming from. A player like Lynch should be worth at least a first rounder and probably more.


The AFL needs to make a realistic judgement on the trade value of a player based on historic trades, then tell the receiving club that they have to pay up that amount.

Basically, free agency is a trade, but where the league determines the value, not the clubs. The clubs can come to an alternate arrangement if they like.

Ultimately, FA will result in a scenario where clubs need to have a version of the despised COLA returned (call it the Player Retention Allowance), and not a small amount either, so they can actually say "fuck off Richmond/Collingwood/Hawthorn" with at least the restricted FAs.

I'd like to see the F/S points system used - let's say Lynch would likely have been valued as pick 1. So if he was to go to Collingwood, and they had the picks they currently have based on this year's ladder, they'd have to cough up 2400 points for pick 1. I believe here some sort of valuation based on the offered contract should be in place.

Collingwood would currently have picks 13, 49 and 67, with a total value of 1568 points, which they'd just have to hand over to GC, with a residual of 832 points to be handed over next year (equivalent to pick 16/17). I'd also say that a club that has any residual points can't trade picks until they're cleared in future seasons.

Gold Coast could alternately ask for a direct points transfer of 2400 points, and use them for any F/S or Academy picks (or, unlikely, Free Agents) they wanted to use them on.

If the two clubs had the same picks the next year, and Collingwood had to cough up 832 points, I'd suggest that they'd have to cough up pick 13 again (1212 points), with GC paying back 380 points, which they can pay back with their next pick after pick 32 (so pick 38 - 268 points, Collingwood lose anything else).

Ultimately, I want it to be if FA exists, the club taking the FA does the paying, at a determined market value.
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Re: Fagan dumps on Free Agency

Postby MrWoollie on Tue Aug 07, 2018 4:44 pm

Fat Side wrote:
sydney eagle wrote:Could a way be found to increase the compensation to the club losing the player to free agency ? What will Gold Coast be likely to get for Lynch under the current system ? A late first round pick ?or a second rounder ? Hardly seems fair. Maybe they could hold an auction and the teams make their bids to the club that he is coming from. A player like Lynch should be worth at least a first rounder and probably more.


The AFL are desperate for the Suns to succeed. Don't be surprised to see them get two first round picks (the first one after their first pick - at the moment pick 2)

I can see a situation where Lynch leaves for a 5 year @ $1Mill pa contract and GC get the two picks you mention (pick 3 and an end of Rd1) and we lose Gaff for a 5 year @ $1Mill pa contract and get a 1st rounder after our pick, about pick 20 after all the priority and compensation picks.
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Re: Fagan dumps on Free Agency

Postby Mr Q on Tue Aug 07, 2018 5:06 pm

MrWoollie wrote:I can see a situation where Lynch leaves for a 5 year @ $1Mill pa contract and GC get the two picks you mention (pick 3 and an end of Rd1) and we lose Gaff for a 5 year @ $1Mill pa contract and get a 1st rounder after our pick, about pick 20 after all the priority and compensation picks.


This is a real issue - a player should be worth what they're worth, not a different amount depending on where their club finished that year.
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Re: Fagan dumps on Free Agency

Postby Crazy Dazz on Thu Oct 04, 2018 5:25 pm

First of all, the fundamental concept is flawed.
You can't have a competition that forces equalisation on everyone, but then say "oh we want to have Free Agency." I'd love to see a comp where a kid who grows up dreaming of playing for the Eagles, gets that chance. But that would lead to a very unbalanced competition.
Secondly, the compensation system is fucked. Imagine if FA had been around when Judd wanted to leave. Instead of Masten, Kennedy, and a 2nd rounder, we'd have got an average 1st round pick and it would have cost Carlton nothing.
And the solution IS simple. The AFL has already quantified the "value" of each pick. So they need simply look at the contract the FA has been offered, assign a Points value to that, and require the club to give up picks accordingly. That would also make teams less likely to make stupid offers.

And Frankly, I am tired of people defending those to choose to take the money and run. Because, do you think our other players didn't have that opportunity? You reckon Kennedy and Shuey wouldn't have been offered a small fortune? Then where would we be. The problem is that players who stay loyal aren't rewarded.

Ironically, once they fix the compensation mechanism, I think the best thing would be to shorten the time. So that rather than players having this attitude of "I'll play my career, THEN go for a bag of cash" they could simply opt to go to a team of their choosing, and if a trade can't be made, then the AFL steps in and assigns a value.
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Re: Fagan dumps on Free Agency

Postby west coast ego on Thu Oct 04, 2018 10:15 pm

The othe part is that free agency is a one way street for player x to get out and name their destination with the club having zero options other than to match an overs offer for a player who doesn't want to be there.

The players association demand the right to free agency, the answer is giving clubs the option to trade players with 1 year left without the player agreeing to it. In that scenario we could have said to gaff/Lycett last year, are you going to extend your contract? We want to sign you up now? If he says no then the club at least have a chance to move him on as a contracted player and get fair compensation.

Would put a stop to this ridiculous 12 month charade of players pretending they haven't made their minds up until the day after the club champion awards dinner
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